Standby for feeding frenzy

Started by akarjl2, January 02, 2020, 07: AM

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akarjl2

QuoteFirst 14 high streets to receive £1bn Government task force funding revealed


https://www.politicshome.com/news/uk/communities/news/108782/first-14-high-streets-receive-£1bn-government-task-force-funding

I wonder who will claim to have pulled this off and where the money gets spent? Refurbishment of Clowncil chambers? More retirement homes to be handed to clowncillers relatives? New chain of office and awards to incompetent morons who did nothing whilst in office? Funding for a new Shame...sorry Shane Party giving him somewhere to hide before local elections? Drunk driver rehabilitation centre?

The snail is asking for suggestions as to how the money should be used to improve the town centre...oddly at the time of writing nobody has suggested pulling Middleton Grange Down and building some social housing. Win Win get rid of charity shops and beggars and provide affordable housing.....move the very few shops that are actually making any money down to the new "Ikea Store" stood empty next to The Gym? or Brenda road.

The Morons seemed to have gone but so have the normals.....

DRiddle

Isn't a big chunk of the funding to pay for the 'expert advice'? I remember a meeting at HBC about 5 or 6 years ago where the council had spent money via funding on some consultancy work about how to improve the town centre.

There was a report, a meeting about the report, a debate about the meeting and the report, and lots of mutual back slapping.

When you scratched beneath the surface the consultants essentially said "you need to put up better signage about where your town centre is' and road off into the night with their fee.




ReturntoZenda

*rode. Thought you were a teacher ?

eddy

I am working on one of these future high street jobs, but I am a low life money grabbing consultant and keen to not upset the narrative about the work that actually goes into these sort of regeneration projects

akarjl2

Quote from: eddy on January 02, 2020, 12: PM
the work that actually goes into these sort of regeneration projects

What regeneration has occurred in Hartlepool over last 30 years? The church street looks like it has been hit by a nuclear weapon. It seems a lot of money has been drained out the system and nothing of any value achieved.
The Morons seemed to have gone but so have the normals.....

eddy

#5
I wasnt involved with any of the work that was completed in Hartlepool and cant comment on the specifics, however in the last 30 years the TDC built the Marina and associated infrastructure which is a pretty significant bit of regeneration in the town (or would you prefer the derelict docklands?).

The problem is it costs a lot of money to do anything these days, there is this miss conception by people that all the design, financial appraisals, viability assessments, land assembly, planning applications, community engagement, marketing and promotion that goes into these sort of regeneration projects should all be done as some massive freebee.  Speaking from experience it costs the think end of £250k in fees to collate the technical reports and information required to submit just the planning application for large strategic regeneration projects.  And thats whether you are a private or public sector client.  Unfortunately low life property consultant types like me have homes and families to feed like everyone else and have to be paid for there time.

Re: why it doesnt work in Hartlepool, probably because the town is a backwater and is fighting a massive uphill battle (backwater in terms of transport connections and proximity to motorways).  It also depends how good the people are working for HBC who go and find development partners or funders to see through the idea to its completion.  A lot of the time they spend money making the roads look nice and street signs but never follow it up with big investment.  The work that is completed at the initial concept stage is only ever an aspiration and needs to be pushed passionately by the council to bring forward the vision, if they dont then it ends up looking half arsed or incomplete. 

The problems for our town centre go well beyond its boundaries though, if you really want to help regenerate it lay of Amazon and buy local.  Thats what is really killing the place and no amount of fancy master plans with funny visual renders will solve that.  If you want to stop church street looking like a bomb site stop buying booze from Tesco and sitting in and go into town with your mates on a Friday night, or go for a meal out, or go support the business that is there at the moment   

mk1

Quote from: eddy on January 02, 2020, 12: PM
I am working on one of these future high street jobs, but I am a low life money grabbing consultant and keen to not upset the narrative about the work that actually goes into these sort of regeneration projects

I believe one of the ways the public was persuaded that all the belt-tightening and cuts were a price worth paying was the way the  'middle class' workers were looked after during the jobs cull. Those at the bottom were ruthlessly targeted and  a whole new 'Training Industry' created and financed. Ostensibly to help the recently made unemployed but in reality it was a job-creation scheme to subsidise the displaced clerical class and keep them on-side. At one time you could not move for recently created Business that would (for a Government Fee) help you write your CV or find you a non-job  placement for another Fee (which would be in the £1000s) whilst you got only your Jobseekers allowance.  The whole charade never produced a single job but those 'in the training sector' made a good living off the pains and suffering of the real unemployed. 
You could get Mickey-Mouse qualifications for scratching your ar*se and I remember one of these sharks were invited into my Factory where they literally gave out a certificate for sweeping up and they made sure you passed any of the tests you had to take by providing you with answer to the questions on a separate sheet.
I really do believe the 'Training Industry' was  a cruel deception where one section/class of worker deliberately colluded with the then Government to exploit the unemployed.

mk1

Quote from: eddy on January 02, 2020, 01: PM


Re: why it doesnt work in Hartlepool, probably because the town is a backwater and is fighting a massive uphill battle (backwater in terms of transport connections and proximity to motorways).


So why don't the 'Planners' face the reality and come out and say that nothing will work until those problems are addressed instead of taking the fee for advice they know will not solve the problem?
I think that too many people are making a good living in this area to worry about the fact that nothing they do, say or recommend  will change anything for the better. Its all a 'rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic' fantasy.

To all those who say I am too pessimistic I refer you to Jackson's Landing, The Garlands fiasco etc

mk1

Quote from: eddy on January 02, 2020, 01: PM
in the last 30 years the TDC built the Marina and associated infrastructure which is a pretty significant bit of regeneration in the town (or would you prefer the derelict docklands?).



Am I the only one who remembers the huge scandal when the TDC  was wound up? Corruption on an industrial scale was uncovered and 'friends' of the right people made massive fortunes out of the money allocated to the area.
Seriously does no one remember?

seaton

Quote from: mk1 on January 02, 2020, 02: PM
Quote from: eddy on January 02, 2020, 01: PM
in the last 30 years the TDC built the Marina and associated infrastructure which is a pretty significant bit of regeneration in the town (or would you prefer the derelict docklands?).



Am I the only one who remembers the huge scandal when the TDC  was wound up? Corruption on an industrial scale was uncovered and 'friends' of the right people made massive fortunes out of the money allocated to the area.
Seriously does no one remember?

I think the figure of around £60 million was uncounted for ?

eddy

#10
"Planners" do say this quite a lot, however we aint going to get funding to divert the A1 via Wolviston anytime soon.  The teams I have worked with on these sort of schemes all feel very passionately about the work they do and don't see it as some gravy train, it's a well held narrative by people with zero knowledge of development and regeneration that they do and has no basis in reality.  However it will always be a challenge and requires a holistic approach, solutions to the bigger problems that underlie our town are ones that affect all of the north east.  Mr Johnson has promised to address the chronic economical imbalances and improve transport links so we will all have to wait with baited breath. 

HBC are going in for this because they have to apply to the gov to get money to complete these reviews.  If they don't put themselves forward they will never get the funding for the feasibility studies to take place.  It's a chicken and egg thing, if they haven't bothered they would have no money to waste on consultant scum and the town centre wouldn't be getting any better (and people would bemoan why aren't our useless council doing something about it).  Its this or nothing, and maybe they can look at improving transport links, or maybe go on a massive aggressive advertising campaign to buy local and stop feeding money to Mr Benzos.  Also being on these Future High Street scheme is likely to be looked more favorably in future funding grants and allowances to actually build the thing.   

Re: TDC, I refer you back to my previous comment re: previous wastelands.  Also public sector procurement these days is ran through an insanely stringent process called NEPRO3, I am in the process of signing up for the new version at the moment and the amount of checks and balances required is mental, mostly because of the years of back handers that went on in the 1980s and 1990s

eddy

Quote from: mk1 on January 02, 2020, 02: PM
Quote from: eddy on January 02, 2020, 12: PM
I am working on one of these future high street jobs, but I am a low life money grabbing consultant and keen to not upset the narrative about the work that actually goes into these sort of regeneration projects

I believe one of the ways the public was persuaded that all the belt-tightening and cuts were a price worth paying was the way the  'middle class' workers were looked after during the jobs cull.

Re: Middle class workers, I count myself as one, over the last 10 years have been through 2 rounds of redundancies, had to lay off people myself, worked a 5 day week and only got paid for 3 and had stagnant wage growth well below what someone 5-10 years my senior got.  I count myself lucky too, a lot of people I know ended up having to leave the industry all together and retrain.  Not really based in reality that point of view IMO

mk1

Quote from: eddy on January 02, 2020, 03: PM

Re: TDC, I refer you back to my previous comment re: previous wastelands........ 

A price worth paying?

That fits well with my claim that if you look after your own (the middle class) its is a price worth paying (by the working class).

TDC was corrupt and openly so but because the people in charge (of enforcing standards) empathised with the corrupt ('our people') then nothing was done about it. At the same time as suitcases full of cash were trundling out the back door at TDC ordinary people were being ruthlessly prosecuted for fiddling £1000 of benefits.
For the record I do not believe TDC corruption was a price worth paying. How say you on the matter?

I love the way you believe it won't happen again and steps have been taken to prevent a recurrence.
Thats corruption sorted them!

mk1

Quote from: eddy on January 02, 2020, 03: PM
Not really based in reality that point of view IMO

I got laid off too. Not for me a cushy job 'training' someone to fill out a form. Believe me I went through a lot of 'Training Schemes' over the years and the bulk were a complete waste of time. My favorite was a Thatcher era  room fool of ex-steelworkers and miners being told by some bright young thing that they could all get jobs in Hotels in The Lake District and they would get subsidised accommodation/holidays whilst being in easy commuting distance for weekends at home.  The room  descended into complete chaos after that helpful advice.
Several Training Firms went bust and were investigated for bogus job placements so its not as if the problem was unknown. Emma Harrison did well out of and A4e

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/9286233/Billion-pound-scandal-in-welfare-to-work.html


Working Links was the same

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Working_Links

and note how the walked away from that one by claiming "allegations all relate to programmes run by the previous government" and that they have measures in place to prevent fraud.''

I believe the Training Industry is institutionally corrupt and I was offered incentives to fake my documentation. 

akarjl2

Quote from: mk1 on January 02, 2020, 02: PM
Quote from: eddy on January 02, 2020, 01: PM


Re: why it doesnt work in Hartlepool, probably because the town is a backwater and is fighting a massive uphill battle (backwater in terms of transport connections and proximity to motorways).


So why don't the 'Planners' face the reality and come out and say that nothing will work until those problems are addressed instead of taking the fee for advice they know will not solve the problem?
I think that too many people are making a good living in this area to worry about the fact that nothing they do, say or recommend  will change anything for the better. Its all a 'rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic' fantasy.

To all those who say I am too pessimistic I refer you to Jackson's Landing, The Garlands fiasco etc

Spot on Sherlock!
The Morons seemed to have gone but so have the normals.....