What's going on?

Started by DRiddle, November 06, 2019, 10: AM

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Inspector Knacker

I'm afraid you are. ;D
No one seems to know how the real situation, unless they were there. So if in doubt.....?
What can be asserted without proof,
can be dismissed without proof.

fred c

To quote mk1

"I say what I say and you can believe or dismiss it at your leisure. I do not care in the least."

That quote also applies to the other posters on this forum who unfortunately are regularly castigated for their opinions.

DRiddle

Here's a 'hypothetical' scenario to chew over.

Supposing a SCAB had campaigned on the promise he would not vote to raise council tax, then once elected, he voted to raise council tax. How would you feel?

Supposing a SCAB had campaigned as an independent in a town showing frustration towards national parties, then, once elected, joined national party. How would you feel?

Supposing a SCAB had literally NAMED Christopher Akers- Belcher in campaign literature, strongly implying he was a big factor in the problems in the council and suggesting assurance that a vote the right way would REMOVE Christopher Akers-Belcher from a position of authority in the council, then, once elected, GIVE him a significant position of authority. How would you feel?

Supposing a SCAB had literally stated he had no desire to become leader of the council, then BECAME leader of the council. How would you feel?

Supposing a SCAB had swore blind he wasn't going to join the Brexit Party, then he joined the brexit party. How would you feel?

Supposing a SCAB shouted from the rooftops about a councillor living and working 100s of miles away from Hartlepool, then MOVED 100 (1000s actually) of miles away to live and work. How would you feel?

The point I am making and MK1 was/is making is crystal clear to me. I can't see why others can't see it.

What's happened on the forum lately is people are being very blinkered by the fact that Shane and the brexit group are NOT the SCABS.

Whilst this is obviously correct, look at the 6 things i've outlined above. They all HAPPENED.

Yet on the forum people seem more fixated in celebrating the fact that the new ruling group are NOT the SCABS. In doing so, they're totally blinkered to a lot of 'scab like hypocrisy'.

You need to realise that literally ANYONE was going to be a 'refreshing change' from the SCABS tenure in control of HBCs purse strings.

No political person or group should ever be totally immune to criticism.

Especially when it's clearly justified when you look at the 6 scenarios i've outlined above.

Take the blinkers off people.






fred c

"The point I am making and MK1 was/is making is crystal clear to me. I can't see why others can't see it.

What's happened on the forum lately is people are being very blinkered by the fact that Shane and the brexit group are NOT the SCABS.

Whilst this is obviously correct, look at the 6 things i've outlined above. They all HAPPENED.

Yet on the forum people seem more fixated in celebrating the fact that the new ruling group are NOT the SCABS. In doing so, they're totally blinkered to a lot of 'scab like hypocrisy'.

You need to realise that literally ANYONE was going to be a 'refreshing change' from the SCABS tenure in control of HBCs purse strings.

No political person or group should ever be totally immune to criticism.

Especially when it's clearly justified when you look at the 6 scenarios i've outlined above.

Take the blinkers off people.


You really need to give people more credit, accusing people of being blinkered is your opinion, it's totally uncalled for and more importantly bollox, of course some of the points you have raised have been acknowledged by members of this forum, the difference between them and you is that they realise things have changed.

There won't be a single user of this forum who wasn't and isn't absolutely and totally aware that any change from the SCABS tenure would be a refeshing change, we don't need you David to tell us that.

It is also your assumption and it is only an assumption that users of this forum are "Fixated in celebrating the fact that the new ruling group are not the SCABS", I don't see any celebrating, what I see is the realisation that those that have replaced them are making a genuine effort to inprove the things.

This post is symptomatic of the visceral bias shown by you towards anyone who doesn't think as you do, look no further than your stance of Brexit.

FYI David, I am not blinkered, nor am I removed from offering criticism on matters in local politics, neither I am prone to talking down to people on this forum or anywhere else, my opinions are every bit as valid as your opinions...... because David, that is all they are opinions.


mk1

Quote from: fred c on November 07, 2019, 12: PM
the difference between them and you is that they realise things have changed.

Have they?
As pointed out we have a 'local' Councillor who has a full-time job with a National Political Party and a post as an MEP. Explain to me how that man can call himself an 'Independent'?

Quote from: fred c on November 07, 2019, 12: PM
what I see is the realisation that those that have replaced them are making a genuine effort to inprove the things.

Are they?
Why have the gone for the maximum CT rise despite promising they would reduce it?


What exactly has improved since Shane lied about being an Independent,  lied about not wanting to join The Brexit Party,   lied about not wanting to be council leader, lied about removing the SCABs and lied about wanting to reduce CT?

mk1

Quote from: fred c on November 07, 2019, 11: AM
To quote mk1

"I say what I say and you can believe or dismiss it at your leisure. I do not care in the least."

That quote also applies to the other posters on this forum who unfortunately are regularly castigated for their opinions.

Glad you pointed out that the problem is snowflakes who can not bear to see their opinions challenged.

DRiddle

My stance on staying or leaving the EU has been consistent for my 10 years plus on this forum. I have yet to hear a coherent, reasoned, evidenced based argument from anyone on here about WHY they think brexit is a good idea.

When challenged to provide reasoning, people quickly resort to 'why should i tell you?, i'll keep my reasons to myself etc.' or they utter some absolutely meaningless 'platitude' about taking back control. In some cases they mask what is fairly clearly xenophobia, behind the mask of 'British values'.

As we speak there are working class lads and lasses in places like Hartlepool chomping at the bit to vote for an old Etonian millionaire because they think he'll deliver on brexit, or for a spiv from the city who probably doesnt know where Hartlepool is on a map.

The reality is IF brexit happens it'll spell the end of the NHS and the gap between the haves and the haves not's will widen sharply and painfully. This election is very likely to lead to 5-10 years more of Tory austerity, broken promises, an almost permanent transition period (Brexit won't happen in the way brexit voters want it to, fact), and further cuts in public services.

I said months and months ago we'd have a big name Brexit party candidate in Hartlepool, possibly even the main man Nigel Farage himself.

It's happening . . . https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/nov/07/brexit-party-chairman-richard-tice-expected-to-stand-in-hartlepool

Nothing good will come of a brexit party council and nothing* good will come of a brexit party hartlepool mp.

But please, crack on.

P.S *One thing good that will come of it is when i collect my winnings at the bookies.  ;)




mk1

Quote from: DRiddle on November 07, 2019, 12: PM


No political person or group should ever be totally immune to criticism.



We lag behind the US but Trumpian Politics are coming here. Boris is openly trying to ape Trump's tactics . This is a recent voter panel after Trump 'lost' Virginia for the Republicans and what the women say is chilling.

https://youtu.be/wsTYso3hmEA?t=355

It is posted as an example of a mind-set that illustrates how  blind loyalty to a political ideal can corrupt.

fred c

"As we speak there are working class lads and lasses in places like Hartlepool chomping at the bit to vote for an old Etonian millionaire because they think he'll deliver on brexit, or for a spiv from the city who probably doesnt know where Hartlepool is on a map"

You appear to be unable to grasp the 'Basic Fact David, that, that is their choice they made that democratic choice at the ballot box.

mk1

Quote from: fred c on November 07, 2019, 04: PM


You appear to be unable to grasp the 'Basic Fact David, that, that is their choice they made that democratic choice at the ballot box.

When given the chance to  confirm this by a vote for a Party that has as its one single  aim the delivery of the hardest possible Brexit they voted  for Labour.


DRiddle

I know it's their 'choice' in theory. However, what I never hear are THEIR views. I hear people quoting rubbish from the Daily Mail and reciting slogans from campaigns funded by billionaire tax dodgers. I hear people passing off the lies of rich men with vested interests as 'truths'.

I'm 'only 42' but never in my life have a seen such a gullible electorate.

I've still yet to hear ONE single coherent arguement for leaving the EU on this forum.

I'm happy to hear one.

Cue the tumbleweeds.

akarjl2

#26
Quote from: DRiddle on November 07, 2019, 03: PM
My stance on staying or leaving the EU has been consistent for my 10 years plus on this forum.

Perhaps you would like to explain why you believe remaining will benefit Hartlepool .....

I voted leave but as the years go by and people forget what it was like not to be governed by Europe, irrespective of the referendum results Brexit is unlikely to happen and I have come to accept it. I

f we had another referendum I would vote remain as we either face years of so called elected representatives not representing their electorate and arguing to prevent Brexit OR we decide to remain and slowly become just a region of Europe governed from Strasburg. Loose/Loose really I see no difference between the muppets in parliament and the leaders of Europe. We need to give up and move on ....

If we remain in Europe ....To throw more grenades in to the discussion...I also believe Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland should be given independence - if we are to in effect become a "region" within Europe let them get on with it ...do away with parliament and give the English region an assembly to run our affairs ....

Ok that is the blue touch paper lit.............
The Morons seemed to have gone but so have the normals.....

akarjl2

Quote from: fred c on November 07, 2019, 04: PM
"As we speak there are working class lads and lasses in places like Hartlepool chomping at the bit to vote for an old Etonian millionaire because they think he'll deliver on brexit, or for a spiv from the city who probably doesnt know where Hartlepool is on a map"

You appear to be unable to grasp the 'Basic Fact David, that, that is their choice they made that democratic choice at the ballot box.

You forgot the other choice -the Hammas/IRA supporting Trotskyist who wants to take us back to the trade union lead lunacy of the 70s.....anyone remember 1979?

There really is no choice in Hartlepool. They all talk and do nothing- it seems pointless even voting.
The Morons seemed to have gone but so have the normals.....

fred c

Quote from: DRiddle on November 07, 2019, 06: PM
I know it's their 'choice' in theory. However, what I never hear are THEIR views. I hear people quoting rubbish from the Daily Mail and reciting slogans from campaigns funded by billionaire tax dodgers. I hear people passing off the lies of rich men with vested interests as 'truths'.

I'm 'only 42' but never in my life have a seen such a gullible electorate.

I've still yet to hear ONE single coherent arguement for leaving the EU on this forum.

I'm happy to hear one.

Cue the tumbleweeds.


Yep, you have the talking down to people you consider inferior to yourself off to a tee.......I have no idea what you mean by a tumble weed, is it a derogatory term and is it aimed at me. ?

DRiddle

No it's not aimed at you Fred.