Labour HOLD Manor House

[mk1]

Finally, Wells has recently repeated the claim that HTH had 'hacked' into his Facebook account.

Would that be a reference to this photo of Ray and his partner?



I wonder why Wells is  ashamed to be gay?
It has not done the SCABs any harm so why should Ray be worried about people finding out about him?

[ARC86]

Quite a remarkable statement to make that steveL, looks as though this by election is gonna get tasty next week

This is why i love politics you get to hear both sides of the argument and
then form your own judgement

More of this please 

[Mr Mister]

Quote..
Raw Wells gave up nothing. His allowance was taken off him by the Remuneration Panel.
The Leader of PHF donates any financial gain from a Leaders Allowance to party funds. Knowing this, Akers-Belcher and Wells came to an arrangement whereby both would make submissions to the RP that the first minority party leader allowance should be halved (PHF) and the second minority leader allowance should disappear. the financial loss to Wells would be made up by giving him a Chair of a Committee.
It was a straight forward attack on the ability of PHF to fight its campaigns by the Labour-Tory Coalition which operates within Hartlepool Council and which we have seen in operation again as Wells chose to virually ignore his own candidate in favour of slagging off PHF on his election leaflet - in effect, using Tory Party funds to support a Labour candidate. If this is OK with you them my e-mail inbox tells me that it isn't OK with a lot of Tories in the town and you should bare that in mind for your own election campaign.

If you don't like the rules, don't play the game... or get more support and do something about it.

Digging Shane out for Ray's actions seems a little unfair to me.

[fred c]

Tales from the Snake Pit, is it any wonder that people are sick to death of what passes for politics in Hartlepool.

We have seen this coalition in operation again as Wells chose to virually ignore his own candidate in the Manor by-election in favour of using the space to slag off PHF on his election leaflet - in effect, using Tory Party funds to support a Labour candidate. If this is OK with you then my e-mail inbox tells me that it isn't OK with a lot of other Tories in the town and you should bare that in mind for your own election campaign.

We haven`t heard a single word of condemnation from "The Dear Leader His Consort" or any member of "The Mob" concerning the mis-use of public monies by MRA, the silence on the same issue from the Tory Mob is deafening.

If Raymondo keeps perfoming at his present level with his own version of the coalition Shane, i think your deposit is highly  likely to go down The Suwannee in 2015.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1S0keeGIgcY

[ARC86]

Fred Labour will be laughing there heads off at this.. PHF & the Conservatives pulling each other apart detracts attention away from what you are trying to achieve.. it may be dirty politics between labour and cons but its having the desired effect!

[SRMoore]

Deary me Steve, you truly have turned into a party sheep haven't you?

I'd love to pick up on a few points if I may.

1. You claim I only comment after hearing half of a story second hand then proceed to tell half a story you have heard second hand because we all know you weren't on the said charabang.

2. So the conservative group had their allowance "taken" by the IRP but PHF's was all a stitch up by Labour and the Conservatives? Tin foil hat time again?

3. You claim that this "joint attack" was to starve PHF of election funds because all of the leaders allowance is donated to the party. Can you tell me how this makes PHF different to Labour who also fund their election campaigns with taxpayers money?
The way I see it there is only the Conservatives and UKIP who fund themselves entirely from members & supporter donations because we certainly don't receive funding from the central party as you would like people to believe.

4. I do not have any "ambitions" to become an MP. Simply to give Iain Wright a sodding good run for his money and make Hartlepool the marginal seat it needs to be to get the attention it deserves whatever the outcome in 2015. Something I would have hoped you would support.

5. Whilst you may fly into a fit or rage whenever I or someone else dare to question or criticise St Geoff, I at least come to this discussion with a level head and will often be the first to stand up and criticise actions of my own party. You cannot say the same and this is a classic example.

You were present at the full council meeting when allowances were discussed as was D Riddle so I'd appreciate it if you could clarify two things for me.

Did Councillor G Lilley as them leader of PHF stand up and request that the recommendation from the IRP to reduce his leaders allowance be ignored and his allowance be put back to the previous level?

If Labour and the Tories had intended to mount a joint attack on PHFs ability to fund campaigns why didn't Labour vote Geoff's request down instead of not only voting for it but, I believe, seconding his proposal?

[SRMoore]

And I will add that I have a lot of time for a number of PHF members. I think the party has a number of cracking activists whom I'd give a lot to have working in our corner but the trouble is that PHF is pretty much like the local Tories...

You have fantastic activists and supporters who are forward thinking and genuinely have the best interests of Hartlepool at heart but you are represented by elected members who don't always live up to expectations.

The only difference being that all of the Tory councillors get on well enough to speak to each other.

[SRMoore]

Refusing to accept the truth and answer a simple question as always, Steve. Turning the conversation back to Ray Wells, a man whom you seem to have an unhealthy obsession/lust for.

Is that the same as shouting at each other in the civic corridors? Only you could be daft enough to blindly defend a man who has sold out the Tory brand and who personally thinks you're a w*n*er.

Please provide the part of my post where I blindly defended anyone or when/where I was called a "w*n*er" or pipe down as you are sounding desperate now.

Though before you do I'd appreciate it if you could clarify two things for me.

Did Councillor G Lilley as then leader of PHF stand up and request that the recommendation from the IRP to reduce his leaders allowance be ignored and his allowance be put back to the previous level?

If Labour and the Tories had intended to mount a joint attack on PHFs ability to fund campaigns why didn't Labour vote Geoff's request down instead of not only voting for it but, I believe, seconding his proposal?

[ARC86]

I think shane asked 5 simple questions steve and not one has been answered except you refering to him as a w*****

[Mr Mister]

Quote..
Raw Wells gave up nothing. His allowance was taken off him by the Remuneration Panel.
The Leader of PHF donates any financial gain from a Leaders Allowance to party funds. Knowing this, Akers-Belcher and Wells came to an arrangement whereby both would make submissions to the RP that the first minority party leader allowance should be halved (PHF) and the second minority leader allowance should disappear. the financial loss to Wells would be made up by giving him a Chair of a Committee.
It was a straight forward attack on the ability of PHF to fight its campaigns by the Labour-Tory Coalition which operates within Hartlepool Council and which we have seen in operation again as Wells chose to virually ignore his own candidate in favour of slagging off PHF on his election leaflet - in effect, using Tory Party funds to support a Labour candidate. If this is OK with you them my e-mail inbox tells me that it isn't OK with a lot of Tories in the town and you should bare that in mind for your own election campaign.

If you don't like the rules, don't play the game... or get more support and do something about it.

Digging Shane out for Ray's actions seems a little unfair to me.

There's nothing wrong with the rules only with the frequency by which the rules are changed to suit the ruling coalition. It's actually quite rare for a council's constitution to be changed, for example, usually only after following a change in legislation. The Peer Group Report highlighted, amongst a raft of other things, the highly unusual high frequency of changes to the constitution of HBC by Councillors.

You know the score Stephen, if you want PHF calling the shots, you need to get the Councillors, if you can't get the Councillors, you ain't got jack sh1t, if you haven't got jack sh1t, you can't do a thing about it, so I guess, in order to measure your parties success, you better win on the Manor, in my lifetime you have not the slightest chance of getting control of the council..

You're up the swanny without a paddle me old mate, you just haven't worked it out yet.

All you're really doing is taking part in PHF's "wet dream"

[steveL]

You know you're right.
I usually do quite well and simply ignore Shane - a bit like Ray Wells actually. I tell you what,  I'll just delete my posts and allow Shane to carry on unfettered - he's happy enough as he is.

[Mr Mister]

Stephen come on,don't be like that, it's just one of them things, some you win and some PHF Lose, it's the way it goes...lol

No need to take your frustration out on poor Shane, if it's Ray you're cross with, phone him up and tell him.

[mk1]

  Ray Wells, a man whom you seem to have an unhealthy obsession/lust for..............

Yuk-not even with your Shane, not even with yours!

Though before you do I'd appreciate it if you could clarify two things for me.

Can I play?

Shane:
1)
What have the local Conservative Party said in public about the MR scandal?

2) Can you point me to a  statement by Wells on the situation?

PHF have more councillors than the Tories and thus  have a bigger mandate than the Conservatives.  Would that be a fair  summation?

[Mr Mister]

Hang on, since when do you answer questions with questions..

I think Shane deserves some answers to his questions, I along with others, are interested to know the answers too..

Surely you PHF boys are not stuck for the answers surely?

You seem to like asking questions but seem afraid to answer any..

It's a bit like saying "Do as you're told and vote PHF"

The are genuine questions the voters might want the answers too.

[DRiddle]

Shane, please take this as genuine advice and not criticism. As I alluded to earlier, there are many people on this forum who recognise your efforts politically. We obviously all may not agree, but most would concur that there is a degree of respect for anyone actually prepared to put their name forward and try to make a difference (for the right reasons).

However, here's the thing which puzzles me regarding this and other threads on the forum.

A little over a year ago you stood for a seat on the Hart Ward.

If you'd gained just 116 more votes you'd already be on our council.

If just 73 of the people in Hart who voted for Paul Beck had instead voted for you, you'd already be on our council.

If just 59 of the people who voted for Keith Fisher had instead voted for you, you'd already be on our council.

Those are the kind of margins we're dealing with in Hartlepool. The difference between Keith Fisher who is on our council, and Moss Body who is not, was just 10 votes, 0.23%, again on the Hart Ward.

So here's my issue.

Why, less than 24 hours after Councillors Beck, Robinson and Fisher failed to even bother to turn up to a meeting, a meeting during which it was decided that a gypsy encampment would be built smack in the middle of their ward, are you on here expending time and energy criticising Geoff Lilley and Putting Hartlepool First?

Please don't see this as a PHF member 'circling the wagons'.

Think really hard about what I've said so far.

The people of the ward you came very close to winning a seat on last May have just been dropped right in the mire by the 3 people they opted to represent them.

Keith Fisher is up for re-election in 2014 right?

That's a year before you might have the Conservative nomination for general election.

So have you joined the dots yet?

The Labour majority is already lower on Hart than in any other ward they have control of.

PHF barely contested Hart last year in that we only put forward a paper candidate. Christine Blakey and David Nin are, to my knowledge, unlikely to stand again as independents come next May.

There are at least 500 'floating voters' on Hart who are just looking for someone to genuinely represent their views, someone who genuinely cares about their needs and wishes.

So if you can maintain your core supporters, and gain just a tiny percentage of the floating voters who will be disgusted with the 'no show' from their councillors yesterday........ you're in.

So remind me again.

Why are you on here sniping about Geoff Lilley's reasons for fighting to maintain a £3k leaders' allowance?

Why are you worrying about PHF's campaign on Owton Manor?

Take some advice from me. Seriously. This is a classic example of why I think some people have pointed a little bit towards a degree of naivety you sometimes demonstrate.

I've never stood for council. I've never been elected. But I understand people.

Forget about the Conservative leaflet currently doing the rounds on Owton Manor. That's not, and will never be a fight you need to be involved in.

Instead, get your own leaflet knocked up over the weekend and spend a few pounds of the money you work hard for, to get a couple of thousand printed.

Utilise the man power you have at your disposal via the young people you work with at Conservative Future, and get the leaflet onto the doormat of every house in Hart by this Sunday.

Let the residents of Hart know, every single one of them that Councillors Fisher, Beck and Robinson had better things to do yesterday than try to prevent a gypsy site being built on their doorstep.

Take the time, trouble and effort to do that, and there's a hell of a good chance you'll be elected next May.

There is of course another option.

You could continue to defend Ray, continue to defend the Tory leaflet being circulated on Owton Manor, and continue to watch the clock waiting for a chance of a seat on Rural West that might well never come.

One last thing.

If you really want to check how you're regarded by Ray, run the idea I've suggested above by him. See what support you get. See if he'll allocate the money from party funds to pay for the leaflet. Hell, go the whole hog and see if he'll pound the pavements with you and deliver a few.

See if he's genuinely serious about increasing the number of Conservative councillors in Hartlepool to beyond three.

See if he's bothered about any other ward than Rural West and his own seat.

I've never met the man, so I don't know the answer as to whether he does.

Although deep down, I think you do know the answer.