Through the rough patch

[Greg X]

"what I actually proposed was a RIGHT NOT TO VOTE, by appending your name next to 'NONE OF THE ABOVE'."

Be careful of the 'NONE OF THE ABOVE' the last time we had that option we got a monkey voted as mayor!

[Benefitcheat]

2) Benefitcheat- be very careful in what you wish for.  Teaching politics at school? - are you sure you mean this?
At present there is ample evidence that children at school are already being polticised IN ONE DIRECTION ONLY.
Multiculturalism, Respect for all religions with the exception of Christianity, EU brainwashing, climate change brainwashing etc.  A distinct left wing bias in all things is currently being hammered into kids.  Are you sure you want to sanction this practice which is more in keeping with authoritarian regimes than in a democratic country.

Never forget - it is the function of education to teach children HOW to think, not WHAT to think.

Also consider that the people who allow this manipulation of young minds are the same people who are pushing for votes at 16.
IM SURE YOU CAN SEE THE CONNECTION.

I'm pretty sure you have a UKIP hat (Though I apologise if I'm wrong) so I'll take what you said with a pinch of salt. I agree that some of the things that happen in education and to be honest in the UK are far too left wing, tolerance of everything that isn't the domain of the white middle/working class and a general unwillingness to tackle extremism.

I didn't say much on the topic as I haven't give it much thought, but I know from speaking to the children of friends and relatives and younger colleagues that they have en-masse no idea how the political system (local or national works) and have no understanding of how their actions could force change if they placed a concerted effort behind one view point over a sustained period of time. Even those who do have a crack at voting for change once but when it doesn't work they give up voting or just follow the herd next time.

It wouldn't be easy to provide a balanced education on the parties and view points, but I think more effort needs to be made to make people understand why voting is important and what their options are if they choose to vote. I do take your point about people shaping young minds but with enough responsible people behind it improved awareness can't be a bad thing.

Perhaps an entirely neutral (Swiss?) body could be set up to translate the key messages of all sides in an election into language that wasn't emotive, disparaging or extreme in nature. The only trouble being that the body would need to be funded by a rich philanthropist with no axe to grind or the govt. In fact I think I've just described what a good media outlet's mission would be. 

[Benefitcheat]

'do you therefore conclude that supporting UKIP and deploring the brainwashing of our kids to be 'at odds'?'

Not at all I just don't quite see the level of bias you refer to in education is any higher than the bias of the mainstream media.

I too deplore brainwashing I just think that as we are stuck with the EU status quo until the collapse of the single currency pans out that people should be made aware of what is going on. And I also agree that those who are the biggest advocates of lower voting ages are just to left of Gahndi in their politics, some of the most active brainwashing in poor areas is being undertaken by the BNP who are preying on the undereducated.

The left aren't all bad,  and just like even the most extreme right have some valid arguments. 

I'm not supposing things would be easy, but in my little utopian world everyone would understand how the democratic system should operate, and be armed with enough information from every side before forming their own views.

[Inspector Knacker]

"I for 1 are very unhappy that my ward councillors kept their seats following the loss of A&E"

Councillors are completely toothless when it comes to strategic (national) decisions on major NHS projects.
Moving the A&E is part of a national initiative to create regional Major Trauma Centres - councillors are there to vote on public toilet provision (locally) - not on the big stuff. You cannot blame them for this in any way.
They have no say and make no difference.

p.s. Still no public toilets in our (jewel in the crown) marina area. Get yer fingers oot!

What...? Councillors may well be toothless gum bangers, but in this case fighting tooth and nail in even a no win battle would have won them some respect instead of what we got. Are you a councillor...?

[Lucy Lass-Tick]

Would you not agree though Mr KD that part of the problem with schools failure to address political literacy is down to the national curriculum and/or the marketization of education, which puts an awful lot of pressure on schools to simply churn out results?

Unfortunately, far too many schools in the U.K. seem to be struggling to teach basic literacy - never mind the political variety... 

[Benefitcheat]

Would you not agree though Mr KD that part of the problem with schools failure to address political literacy is down to the national curriculum and/or the marketization of education, which puts an awful lot of pressure on schools to simply churn out results?

Unfortunately, far too many schools in the U.K. seem to be struggling to teach basic literacy - never mind the political variety...

That's mainly because schools have failed for so long we have a nation of parents and grandparents who can barely read a road sign and wouldn't ever dream of inviting books into their homes. Some people even think that most popular books are based on films and not the other way round.

You can't lay the blame for everything at the door of the schools, especially when we have a growing culture that says you don't need to try because money is free anyway.

[Lucy Lass-Tick]

Quite right Benefitcheat...we (unfortunately) now appear to have a culture where the value of literacy is not recognised by far too many and where the veneration of cheap 'celebrities' reigns supreme. Both parents and schools must play their part in guiding and training the next generation.  It is, unfortunately, not exactly new for there to be clashes of opinion regarding what is to be prioritised and how teaching and learning should take place, as educational theories change all the time.

As a trainee primary teacher in the mid 1970s I remember my education tutor wanting me to scrap a class of 7 year olds' reading scheme for the 8 week duration of my teaching practice.  Fortunately for the children's continuity of learning, the head countermanded this disruption of the basics, considering it's planned replacement (creating a life size African hut in the corner of an already crowded classroom) to be a little unwise!

What I am suggesting as that schools have enough problems, without adding political literacy to their remit - the following blog from the Guardian is both enlightening and frightening...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/teacher-network/teacher-blog/2012/may/19/secret-teacher-letter-home

[Benefitcheat]

we (unfortunately) now appear to have a culture where the value of literacy is not recognised by far too many and where the veneration of cheap 'celebrities' reigns supreme.

Facebook, email, text messaging and twitter seem to take pride of place in my list of culprits for allowing this to grow unchecked.

So many people can't understand why social networking comments, posted next to a photograph of themselves reflect on them as a person. The social networking malaise spreads so quickly they think it's acceptable to spell poorly in school, when applying for jobs and when contacting schools about their own children.

In my work I receive a lot of unsolicited job applications, some of which are well written and thought out, some are just behind Yosser Hughes attempts at an application. The key difference being that Yosser got of his backside and would have put a tie on for an interview, I'm the kind of man who hates wearing a suit but if I turned up for a job interview for a cleaner at McDonalds I'd still put a tie on.

Anyway what was this thread about?

[The Great Dictator]

He sounds Jamaican.

[Greg X]

What...? Councillors may well be toothless gum bangers, but in this case fighting tooth and nail in even a no win battle would have won them some respect instead of what we got. Are you a councillor...?

No. A realist. Why spend time fighting a lost cause when one's energy could be spent doing something useful.

[mk1]

Why spend time fighting a lost cause when one's energy could be spent doing something useful.

Like getting a respray to match the new wheels?

[notenoughsaid]

To Perseus...Being a bit older than most and not using text speak etc. I am quite able to decipher the various messages/examples you posted but could you/would you please explain why it is necessary for youngsters to corrupt  a perfectly viable language when it is probably easier to learn the original than adulterate it in this way? Surely if the slang is encouraged for ease  the true language will be lost.What will  we be left with?

[for fawkes sake]

Perseus - I have trouble enough making sense of half of what you say without you starting to jumble the letters up.

[notenoughsaid]

To Perseus.... point  taken ,"Methinks",in particular,thanks for your reply. Do you ever travel on buses in the area.?   Not only are the youngsters electronically sending correspondence like this but they actually convert it into speech.Young girls in particular are becoming very loud and  gutteral and sometimes sound eastern European to my ears. Not being nosey but the volume prevents one from overhearing.   Glad to get off sometimes.!!!

[Greg X]

"It'll be interesting to see where the English language is in 20 years time. "

Take a holiday in the USA this summer and you will hear our future.
There is a 'Parking LOT' for rent next to Drive Vauxhall - next to McDonalds, where everyone under 25 asks, "Can I get a large BigMac meal."

Have a nice day!